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kaleu Throbbing Titan UID 45445 Digest Posts 0 Credits 3308 Posts 1512 Karma 3224 Acceptance 1672 Reading Access 70 Registered 24-5-2010 Location PRC Status Offline

#1 Post at 1-6-2010 12:34  Profile P.M.  Font size: S M L KTV "gift" etiquette? Most of my visits to KTV have been with management from companies I do business with.  At the end of every night they offer to pay for a girl if I want.  I only take them up on this maybe 1/6 of the time.  But I recently found out that a coworker of mine accepts every time.  Now I know all about the business culture in China, but I wonder if you all think it would damage a business relationship to accept more of these offers.  I have never seen one of them take a girl after, but of course they do all sorts of stuff at the KTV.  And they know I am single. Just wondering what you opinions are.  Should I take advantage of the offers, or do you think they feel obligated to offer and accepting or declining affects their respect for me?

DaBestHK Godfather of Hole UID 38266 Digest Posts 0 Credits 9074 Posts 6140 Karma 8967 Acceptance 2136 Reading Access 90 Registered 19-1-2010 Status Offline

#2 Post at 1-6-2010 13:35  Profile P.M.  Font size: S M L Reply #1 kaleu's post nothing is free. taking a lady home on their tab will make it hard for you to make the right decision (whether positive or negative) and its very hard to be objective about it if you take the lady everytime. entertainment (even adult kind) is acceptable, and that includes time at the KTV. i prefer not to take a lady home at their expense, so i usually insist on paying for my lady if i'm taking her home.

geoduck Godfather of Hole UID 41248 Digest Posts 0 Credits 7512 Posts 3232 Karma 7419 Acceptance 1854 Reading Access 90 Registered 12-3-2010 Status Offline

#3 Post at 1-6-2010 13:37  Profile P.M.  Font size: S M L QUOTE: Originally posted by kaleu at 1-6-2010 12:34 Most of my visits to KTV have been with management from companies I do business with.  At the end of every night they offer to pay for a girl if I want.  I only take them up on this maybe 1/6 of the t ... If they offer you a girl then you should definitely go for it. Perhaps the reason they have not taken girls out themselves is because their mission was to entertain you and they felt it was impolite to take girls when you're not.

geoduck Godfather of Hole UID 41248 Digest Posts 0 Credits 7512 Posts 3232 Karma 7419 Acceptance 1854 Reading Access 90 Registered 12-3-2010 Status Offline

#4 Post at 1-6-2010 13:44  Profile P.M.  Font size: S M L QUOTE: Originally posted by DaBestHK at 1-6-2010 13:35 nothing is free. taking a lady home on their tab will make it hard for you to make the right decision (whether positive or negative) and its very hard to be objective about it if you take the lady eve ... In usual circumstances, I would take out customers and get them laid because I've already a long standing business relationship with them. If it's a new customer then I would just take them for dinner. If however they want to go get laid, they would usually pay for the girl themselves as this would not compromise them in doing business with you.

atomic3d Throbbing Titan UID 41127 Digest Posts 0 Credits 3282 Posts 2642 Karma 3157 Acceptance 2501 Reading Access 70 Registered 10-3-2010 Status Offline

#5 Post at 1-6-2010 14:14  Profile P.M.  Font size: S M L Reply #3 geoduck's post My experience has been that the Chinese tend to hold westerners up to a higher standard than natives as regards following legal and so called moral standards. I try to disabuse my Chinese acquaintances of this notion, but they still tend to cling to this line. Would not accepting this entertainment lower his standing in the eyes of the other company management people, whatever they might say to the contrary and perhaps compromise his ability to get the best deal possible for his own company?

sexpert Erotic Emperor UID 6099 Digest Posts 0 Credits 2144 Posts 1895 Karma 2117 Acceptance 546 Reading Access 60 Registered 20-12-2007 Location NYC and Mong Kok Status Offline

#6 Post at 1-6-2010 19:36  Profile P.M.  Font size: S M L QUOTE: Originally posted by atomic3d at 1-6-2010 14:14 My experience has been that the Chinese tend to hold westerners up to a higher standard than natives as regards following legal and so called moral standards. I try to disabuse my Chinese acquaintance ... One has to hold Westerners up to higher standards because you never know if they get offended or not by this.  Not to bring in religion but there are a lot more Western Christians and I've run into a few married guys who will never go mongering with me.  You have to test the waters by slightly suggesting these things and see their reactions.  My trick is to say something like, "in China we tend to take out our clients to KTV clubs to be accompanied by women to talk about business" There is NOTHING ambiguous about their reactions ever!  Usually it's "are they young, fresh and pretty!?" and my reply would be HELL YES!  or "I'd prefer not to" and my reply would be THANK GOD! Because it's such an outdated practice and I always feel so uncomfortable at these places but it's a necessary evil to do business in China most of the time! LOL  you gotta do, what you gotta do!

flyfly Carnal Conqueror UID 10307 Digest Posts 0 Credits 331 Posts 154 Karma 329 Acceptance 30 Reading Access 30 Registered 8-4-2008 Status Offline

#7 Post at 2-6-2010 00:30  Profile P.M.  Font size: S M L QUOTE: Originally posted by sexpert at 1-6-2010 19:36 One has to hold Westerners up to higher standards because you never know if they get offended or not by this.  Not to bring in religion but there are a lot more Western Christians and I've run into  ... That's a good one, good idea to have a backup line and play it that way

javku Lustful Lord UID 39687 Digest Posts 0 Credits 971 Posts 254 Karma 967 Acceptance 74 Reading Access 40 Registered 11-2-2010 Status Offline

#8 Post at 2-6-2010 01:17  Profile P.M.  Font size: S M L I would not let my friend pays for any girls that I sleep with... some people say it will bring bad luck

sexpert Erotic Emperor UID 6099 Digest Posts 0 Credits 2144 Posts 1895 Karma 2117 Acceptance 546 Reading Access 60 Registered 20-12-2007 Location NYC and Mong Kok Status Offline

#9 Post at 2-6-2010 07:43  Profile P.M.  Font size: S M L Reply #8 javku's post This is a really outdated and misunderstood notion by the Chinese.  I've heard this shit so many times but NO ONE can give you a definitive answer on who gets the bad luck and who takes the good luck, the giver or receiver?  It's all bullshit!  I used to feel the same way and believed this crap from some of my buddies but now, if I win at gambling, everyone goes whoring on me!!

This_Is_My_Vice Lustful Lord UID 30737 Digest Posts 0 Credits 580 Posts 482 Karma 573 Acceptance 144 Reading Access 40 Registered 8-9-2009 Location USA Status Offline

#10 Post at 2-6-2010 09:34  Profile P.M.  Font size: S M L Reply #1 kaleu's post So...is your company hiring?   I'll be more than happy to work with management of these other companies who do business with you! But I do understand your dilemma.  Some people might see it as an insult if you reject their offer, but others might see you as taking advantage of their generosity if you continue to accept their gifts.  They might just be offering to be polite.  Who knows, I'm not familiar enough with those businesses in HK to make a determination.

aidafan Lustful Lord UID 41319 Digest Posts 0 Credits 527 Posts 339 Karma 524 Acceptance 57 Reading Access 40 Registered 14-3-2010 Status Offline

#11 Post at 2-6-2010 10:43  Profile P.M.  Font size: S M L The best thing is to be polite and refuse taking the girl, saying you drank too much and would like to sleep. In business relations, its best to keep it to business and not go overboard with the pleasure part of it. For me, If I want pleasure I do it in my own time. Plus, its not always good to be a freeloader cause you might feel you owe them something, although subconciously and that may affect your decisions in business with them.

geoduck Godfather of Hole UID 41248 Digest Posts 0 Credits 7512 Posts 3232 Karma 7419 Acceptance 1854 Reading Access 90 Registered 12-3-2010 Status Offline

#12 Post at 2-6-2010 12:13  Profile P.M.  Font size: S M L Reply #11 aidafan's post The point of all this is, if your Chinese business associates do not want you to get laid, why would they bring you to a KTV with WGs in the first place? Think that if you all take out a girl, it's part of the male bonding experience. If they don't want you to get a girl, then they will just take you out for a dinner and some drinks and that's the end of the evening.

kaleu Throbbing Titan UID 45445 Digest Posts 0 Credits 3308 Posts 1512 Karma 3224 Acceptance 1672 Reading Access 70 Registered 24-5-2010 Location PRC Status Offline

#13 Post at 2-6-2010 14:17  Profile P.M.  Font size: S M L If it makes a difference, these are mainland Chinese companies. The thing is, I have never seen one of them take a girl after KTV.  In my Western opinion this is because they are trying to save face with me.  I don't know if they are married or not as that has never come up. I have gone shopping in Dongguan before and they either accompany me or send someone from the office "to translate," but in the end they insist on buying me what I pick out.  I don't really like it because I don't want to pick out the expensive things I might really want.  One time I politely insisted they not buy the item and I felt later that it caused a bit of a scandal. So back to the KTV, it seems like a balancing act between not offending my hosts (and getting a free punt), and not seeming like sleaze since they don't seem to participate in this themselves.

aidafan Lustful Lord UID 41319 Digest Posts 0 Credits 527 Posts 339 Karma 524 Acceptance 57 Reading Access 40 Registered 14-3-2010 Status Offline

#14 Post at 2-6-2010 22:33  Profile P.M.  Font size: S M L Reply to Geoduck:              Yes, they want you to get laid and this is mostly done to get favour from you. My company boss regularly takes lots of customers to KTV, and in return he gets their favour and their approval. Its an endless cycle. Personally I just tag along, and at the end of the evening I take the girls number and call her sometime later in the week. 2 birds with one stone!             The point here is how you do business. If you dont want anything else affecting your decision making other than the quality of the company and its products, then dont take the gril. monger in your own free time.

arkblood Nookie Newbie UID 44992 Digest Posts 0 Credits 2 Posts 2 Karma 2 Acceptance -1 Reading Access 10 Registered 17-5-2010 Status Offline

#15 Post at 4-6-2010 00:37  Profile P.M.  Font size: S M L the culture.. It's business culture in the China.. It's rule. Enjoy and buy it.

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